Anthropologist David Graeber explores the bureaucratic dimension that rules our lives, takes our money, and stretches between the public and private, the right and the left, between capitalism and whatever comes next. David's new book is The Utopia of Rules: On Technology, Stupidity, and the Secret

Tim and Dave discuss, and debate, the phenomenon of bullshit jobs. The role of the rich in the 2008 financial crisis is discussed and there is a VIGOROUS debate about the value of banking in the economy. House of Cards is discussed, and a major historical inaccuracy in its dialogue is revealed!