…researchers who who were toiling away and building the framework around these discoveries. Brilliant chemists, people like Robert Oberlander or David Repke or Peyton Jacobs or... Stuart Frescus, and the list goes on and on and on. These are people who…

…him when I say how great his scientific research was. His dissertation, the papers that he co-authored with Shulgin and Repke, these are seminal psychedelic papers that are absolutely crucial to read if you want to understand some of the fundamental…

…But you've also done quite a few publications on synthetic psychedelic compounds. You co-authored a really amazing publication with David Repke, where you looked at the relative 2A and 1A binding affinities of a variety of different, very unusual tryptamine…

…of a variety of different, very unusual tryptamine psychedelics. Could you tell me a little bit about that paper? I mean... David Repke did such remarkable work and his name is almost never mentioned in discussions of psychedelic history. And I also can't…

…in discussions of psychedelic history. And I also can't help but wonder, was anybody testing these compounds? Were you or Repke doing self-experiments with those compounds in conjunction with the binding work? Yeah. Well, yes, I wasn't. I didn't have enough…

…work? Yeah. Well, yes, I wasn't. I didn't have enough to actually test. I got a few milligrams from him and from Shulgin. But Repke was testing them and Sasha was testing them. And yeah, so there was, there was testing going on. In fact, I think that…

…so there was, there was testing going on. In fact, I think that they reported some of that in one of the papers and he, Repke got into big trouble with, with Syntex where he worked because of that. He didn't do the work at Syntex, but he, he did…